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Discussion: Let's all talk "Regarding Dean" (S12 E11) here!Reported This is a featured thread

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journalbookbinder
journalbookbinder
20. RE: Let's all talk "Regarding Dean" (S12 E11) here!
Feb 10 2017, 1:19 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 10 2017, 1:19 PM EST
I have a weird lamp like that; it's very stick-like and it's actually a "daylight" lamp that's supposed to help give you that daylight effect in the depths of winter or in a room where you only have artificial light...but I doubt something like that would be found in a motel room!

I was confused by the post-it's too. I thought Rowena wrote them (as she was the last one with Dean before he woke up in the car; Sam had already left to go after the witches)...Kate thought that maybe Sam wrote some of the ones in the trunk (like the hilarious "NO!" on the grenade launcher)...I don't know if all of those were from Rowena...I thought they were from her; following Sam's lead on what he did in the room. Sam wouldn't call the Impala a "stupid car" so I think that one and the "STAY!" had to be from Rowena, right?

Did anyone else think as I did that Dean actually LOOKED YOUNGER when he wasn't saddled with his usual baggage? That just hit me so hard and was so obvious to me.

It seems they got a lot right here if the comments are anything to go by. Seems it struck a chord with many of us for different personal reasons.

BTW, it's not memory, but I also had a customer who passed away from ALS (probably one of the worst diseases to endure, in my opinion) and that's kinda the opposite; your mind is fine but your body breaks down to the point that the muscles in your lungs become to weak and that's the end. Parts of this reminded me of that as far as your body "forgetting" how to breathe. With ALS it seems more of a weakening than a forgetting, but similar.
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Wandlimb
Wandlimb
21. RE: Let's all talk "Regarding Dean" (S12 E11) here!
Feb 10 2017, 5:19 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 10 2017, 6:23 PM EST
I looked again and Sam wrote the yellow notes; the purple was from Rowena.
I fixed the link to the image of the post-it v. the purple note: https://www.dropbox.com/s/5nteu1ka3w2vnm4/posits.jpg?dl=0
Pretty great. :)
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1raith
1raith
22. RE: Let's all talk "Regarding Dean" (S12 E11) here!
Feb 10 2017, 5:47 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 10 2017, 5:47 PM EST
@ Wandlimb: You know, after re-watching it, I say it's tie with "Lily Sunders" with my favorite episode of the season now. I still don't think it's an achievement in terms of plot, but when it came to acting, it delivered.

@JournalBB: Yeah, Motel rooms usually have such crappy furniture. And I don't think he looked younger, IMO, but he sure as hell ages very well. J&J both do.

@Kate: Those are all valid reasons. It's just that I want more people the brothers CAN trust closer to them. The same way they trust Cole, Garth and Jodi. And I hope they trust Lily as well, since she could be very useful to Sam and Dean.

I need reiterate just how powerful the mirror scene is. I truly believe this is one of Jensen's best acting scenes he's ever done. 12 seasons and this show still can pull at your heart like it's nothing. I cannot not feel upset when I see this. Just amazing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u7BqI5lYwBk
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PigNaPoke
PigNaPoke
23. RE: Let's all talk "Regarding Dean" (S12 E11) here!
Feb 10 2017, 5:49 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 10 2017, 5:49 PM EST
"I looked again and Sam wrote the yellow notes; the purple was from Rowena.
I put a screenshot collage here: http://i63.tinypic.com/2i9ik91.jpg
Pretty great. :)
"
Hi Wandlimb,

I agree with you. I believe there were TWO sets of notes - purple for Rowena and yellow for Sam. They had very different hand writing and I thought that Sam would have continued the notes from inside the motel room into the car trunk just in case Dean got away from him and had the need to protect himself. I thought that mostly (aside from the hand writing) because of the big fat NO on the granate launcher, because Rowena wouldn't know about that inside joke.

PNP
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PigNaPoke
PigNaPoke
24. RE: Let's all talk "Regarding Dean" (S12 E11) here!
Feb 10 2017, 6:06 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 10 2017, 6:16 PM EST
Hi Y'All,

LOTS of great and interesting opinions here!!!

I had some issues with the episode, but overall it was very good.

Positive first - cause that's just me:
- Very nicely "brother centric" focused episode
- Loved Sam being the ROCK and protector in this one
- BOTH Jared and Jensen totally knocked this out of the park as many of you already said
- Good mix of funny and sad - although I felt a few times that the writer tried a little too hard for funny where it made no sense to me or was unnecessary
- very nice dynamic between Sam and Rowena in this one. I think they have developed a grudging respect for each others methods and abilities and still hold a healthy mistrust for the other knowing that it is an alliance of need/reward on both sides (kinda reminds me of the relationship the boys had with Crowley early on)
- the collage at the end was sweet/sad/hot (Dean riding the bull) and very poignant
- Glad Rowena showed some power and really liked her little exposition for all the same reasons kate mentioned


CONTINUES....
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PigNaPoke
PigNaPoke
25. RE: Let's all talk "Regarding Dean" (S12 E11) here!
Feb 10 2017, 6:13 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 10 2017, 6:13 PM EST
Continued...

The not so good:
- the singular thing that bugged me the most was that Dean pretended to still be under the spell for a moment after he was cured. I simply can't believe that Dean would be so thoughtless or cruel when he a) sees the absolute misery on Sam's face at the bottom of the stairs and b) he KNOWS how hard it is to think that you lost your brother. That bit just didn't seem funny to me because it didn't ring true for me for Dean's character
- Why the HELL is the blonde witch SINGING?? Highly annoying
- Useless visual cut back to the Finance guy's office so we (stupid) audience can figure out that the dead witch was the guy in the picture. (Really not dumb over here...)
- Conversation between Rowena and the other witch was too long and full of uninteresting info...I doubt we'll ever need that.
- Why does the male witch stand on the stairs for so long without doing anything? If they were so powerful that makes no sense to me.

The odd:
- the motel room was weirdly too nice for the outside of the dump.
- Dean uses witch killing bullets behind the bar, but Sam only figures out after they find the hex bag in the coroner's office that they are dealing with a witch??
Seems like we were missing a bit of the story there.

So, it was a little bit of a mixed bag for me, but I will rewatch with many of your great points in mind and see if that changes my perception.

PNP
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PigNaPoke
PigNaPoke
26. RE: Let's all talk "Regarding Dean" (S12 E11) here!
Feb 10 2017, 6:23 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 10 2017, 6:23 PM EST
"-Sam going in all Rambo against a family of powerful witches. I was thinking, "Sam(the writers) can't be that dumb to do that?". Then well...we saw what happened. Come on, he's an experienced Hunter, he should've known that was going to happen. Definitely an aspect that's not in Sam's character.
-Dean losing his memory isn't important enough to call either Cas or Mary. Give me a break. Should Sam call his mother (who has resources from BMOL) or an angel? Nope, he calls a witch that he doesn't trust and screwed him over many times. Nevermind the witch friend they have who's a cop or even Asa's kids that he and Dean helped out.

-I wish Sam asked Dean more poignant questions regarding his memory, like if he remembers John, or Bobby or some childhood memories or past moments in the show.
"
Hi 1raith,
although I agree that Sam's charging in on his own was a little foolish and seemed doomed from the get-go, I appreciated Sam's take-charge-attitude in this episode very much. It was almost like Sam had to make up for Dean's missing ability and took on some of the normally more "Dean tactics" because someone had to?!

Totally agree on the second point - missed opportunity and they could have easily fit in more brother dialogue if they left some of the pointless Rowena & blonde witch babble out. :)

PNP
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PigNaPoke
PigNaPoke
27. RE: Let's all talk "Regarding Dean" (S12 E11) here!
Feb 10 2017, 6:25 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 10 2017, 6:25 PM EST
"1raith...good ideas...yes, it could have been more poignant if Bobby or John had been brought up....

I can see them not calling Mary because they didn't want to bring her in or upset her. It made sense to me that they called a witch (even an untrustworthy one) to find out how to deal with other witches. Even if Cas is trustworthy, he may not have known as much as Rowena.

BTW...even when Dean was with Rowena in full amnesia mode in the motel, when he heard the crash on the phone, he still yelled out for Sam. I almost think Sam would be the last thing he'd forget even if he forgot himself first.

Of course, in the end, Dean would keep the painful memories instead of being free of it all but also forgetting life with Sam."
Hi JBB,
I totally agree with you on why Sam called Rowena over the others. Fight fire with fire and all. Rowena was the best option they had under the circumstances.

And I TOTALLY LOVED that moment, too, where Dean called out Sam's name when he heard the crash through the phone - for the same reasons you mention!!

PNP
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Wandlimb
Wandlimb
28. RE: Let's all talk "Regarding Dean" (S12 E11) here!
Feb 10 2017, 6:26 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 10 2017, 6:26 PM EST
"Continued...

The not so good:
- the singular thing that bugged me the most was that Dean pretended to still be under the spell for a moment after he was cured. I simply can't believe that Dean would be so thoughtless or cruel when he a) sees the absolute misery on Sam's face at the bottom of the stairs and b) he KNOWS how hard it is to think that you lost your brother. That bit just didn't seem funny to me because it didn't ring true for me for Dean's character
- Why the HELL is the blonde witch SINGING?? Highly annoying
"
Yes, I thought that was mean, too! I don't know, maybe Dean didn't want to get emotional in front of Rowena. Maybe just a writer's trick.

I thought the witch's singing was super creepy! I liked these witches.
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PigNaPoke
PigNaPoke
29. RE: Let's all talk "Regarding Dean" (S12 E11) here!
Feb 10 2017, 6:28 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 10 2017, 6:28 PM EST
"Another good episode, I thought!

I'm just gonna ask this -- is anyone else looking forward to the gag reel to see how many times it took Jensen to say “devil baby mama drama” without messing it up? And I'm sure there's gag reel footage of the bull ride :)

"
HAHAHA, kate,

there BETTER be more of the bull riding footage on the gag reel. Hopefully including a tumble off!
Has anyone every TRIED to ride one of these?? I have and it is freakin' HARD!
Jensen made it look really easy....

PNP
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catleigh
catleigh
30. RE: Let's all talk "Regarding Dean" (S12 E11) here!
Feb 10 2017, 9:39 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 10 2017, 9:39 PM EST
You guys are fast! And have pretty much covered all the ups and downs of this episode, so not much to add except count me in as another one who thoroughly enjoyed this episode.

Ok, a few things: I loved the montage at the end, just b/c I'm a fan of the show and Jensen, but it seemed odd and out of place to me in the context of the episode--kind of like the director said, "gosh, we've got this great footage of the bullride that doesn't really fit in the episode, what can I do with it?"

I wasn't happy with the 'Sam charges in without a decent plan' plot twist. It was dumb, the results were predictable, and it turned this into another episode where Sam becomes a secondary character. And Rowena, the most powerful witch alive with the most powerful spellbook ever, who can open frickin' Satan's Cage and even banish the Devil incarnate to the bottom of the sea...she gets her butt kicked by one other witch after getting in only one attack herself? And both Sam and Rowena need a 'rescue' from amnesiac Dean armed with the knowledge contained on a sticky note? Weak ending to what was an otherwise great episode. I think it's just the 'break-in' period for our talented new writers, but isn't it Dabb and Singer's job to keep them from going astray? Major fail on that front,IMO.

I didn't see anyone else mention it, but I thought the waitress from bullriding burger joint/bar was awesome. That actress did a fine job with a tiny little role and I kind of wish Dean would go back for a visit again soon.

Promos for next week have me biting my nails, even if I don't believe they'll kill off Cas.
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PigNaPoke
PigNaPoke
31. RE: Let's all talk "Regarding Dean" (S12 E11) here!
Feb 11 2017, 8:17 AM EST | Post edited: Feb 11 2017, 8:17 AM EST
"

I didn't see anyone else mention it, but I thought the waitress from bullriding burger joint/bar was awesome. That actress did a fine job with a tiny little role and I kind of wish Dean would go back for a visit again soon.

Promos for next week have me biting my nails, even if I don't believe they'll kill off Cas."
Hi CATLEIGH,
I agree with you on the waitress actress!! Very good job on making a small role into a three dimensional character that the viewer actually cares for.
I loved the bar scenes where we went from indignant and annoyed to concerned to horrified that she might have 'taken advantage' of Dean ( and his answering face was priceless, too).

PNP
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Wandlimb
Wandlimb
32. RE: Let's all talk "Regarding Dean" (S12 E11) here!
Feb 11 2017, 11:07 AM EST | Post edited: Feb 11 2017, 11:07 AM EST
"Ok, a few things: I loved the montage at the end, just b/c I'm a fan of the show and Jensen, but it seemed odd and out of place to me in the context of the episode--kind of like the director said, "gosh, we've got this great footage of the bullride that doesn't really fit in the episode, what can I do with it?"

... And Rowena, the most powerful witch alive with the most powerful spellbook ever, who can open frickin' Satan's Cage and even banish the Devil incarnate to the bottom of the sea...she gets her butt kicked by one other witch after getting in only one attack herself? And both Sam and Rowena need a 'rescue' from amnesiac Dean armed with the knowledge contained on a sticky note? Weak ending to what was an otherwise great episode. I think it's just the 'break-in' period for our talented new writers..."
Hi catleigh,
While I wound up enjoying the montage, you are right about it being odd and out of place. I wonder if it was in the script or not?

I maintain that Sam being reckless when Dean is endangered is true to character. But, I do wish they would make up their mind about Rowena -- if she's so powerful, as you point out, how could she be so easily over-powered by blondie? I also thought she was a bit too cooperative, especially when she handed back the book at the end. Self-interest seemed to require more than just the Winchesters owing her one.

So, this was a new writer? Cool! Seems to have done their homework.

I haven't watched the promos for next week. Sounds good!
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catleigh
catleigh
33. RE: Let's all talk "Regarding Dean" (S12 E11) here!
Feb 11 2017, 11:27 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 11 2017, 11:27 PM EST
"I maintain that Sam being reckless when Dean is endangered is true to character. But, I do wish they would make up their mind about Rowena -- if she's so powerful, as you point out, how could she be so easily over-powered by blondie? I also thought she was a bit too cooperative, especially when she handed back the book at the end. Self-interest seemed to require more than just the Winchesters owing her one.

So, this was a new writer? Cool! Seems to have done their homework.
"
Hi Wandlimb,

Yeah, Sam being reckless to save Dean is true...but I thought 'reckless' was covered by calling in Rowena...going off to face the witches with essentially no plan except 'I've got some witch-killing bullets and I'm Sam f-ing Winchester' was stupid. Totally on the same page with the Rowena thing--thought we'd find she'd switched the book there at the end.

And yep, this ep was written by Meredith Glynn, new this year--also gave us the Nazi/grenade launcher episode.
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kate38
kate38
34. RE: Let's all talk "Regarding Dean" (S12 E11) here!
Feb 12 2017, 10:45 AM EST | Post edited: Feb 12 2017, 10:45 AM EST
"I maintain that Sam being reckless when Dean is endangered is true to character. But, I do wish they would make up their mind about Rowena -- if she's so powerful, as you point out, how could she be so easily over-powered by blondie? I also thought she was a bit too cooperative, especially when she handed back the book at the end. Self-interest seemed to require more than just the Winchesters owing her one.

So, this was a new writer? Cool! Seems to have done their homework.

I haven't watched the promos for next week. Sounds good!"
Hi, wandlimb --

I guess I wasn't all that surprised that the other witch overpowered Rowena. From what they were saying to each other, the other witch is older than Rowena and was in a position to teach Rowena some things about witchcraft. So it seems to me that witches are made powerful by who they are and what they know, but ALSO by what powerful items they have in their possession. It's reasonable to me that Rowena is very old and powerful by most standards, but there are other witches out there who can beat her, and we simply met one of them.

And we also know that no matter how powerful you are, you can still be beaten. Once Amara finally got her hands on Chuck, it only took her one zap to injure him to the point of near death.

I agree with you that Rowena seemed to hand over that book to Sam too easily. We also never saw Sam look at the book or look through it to make sure she didn't switch it out. It would be just like her to do that and trick them.

Kate
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